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E00256: Eusebius of Caesarea, in his Ecclesiastical History, reports that, when he wrote, two tombs of John were known in Ephesos (western Asia Minor), one ascribed to *John the Evangelist (S00042) and another to the obscure apostle *John the Elder (S01115). Written in Greek in Palestine, 311/325.
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posted on 2015-01-14, 00:00 authored by dlambertEusebius of Caesarea, Ecclesiastical History 3.39.4-6
Eusebius quotes a fragment from Papias of Hierapolis (early 2nd c. AD), who reports having collected oral traditions about the doctrines of the Apostles from people who had met them:
(4.) «εἰ δέ που καὶ παρηκολουθηκώς τις τοῖς πρεσβυτέροις ἔλθοι, τοὺς τῶν πρεσβυτέρων ἀνέκρινον λόγους, τί Ἀνδρέας ἢ τί Πέτρος εἶπεν ἢ τί Φίλιππος ἢ τί Θωμᾶς ἢ Ἰάκωβος ἢ τί Ἰωάννης ἢ Ματθαῖος ἤ τις ἕτερος τῶν τοῦ κυρίου μαθητῶν ἅ τε Ἀριστίων καὶ ὁ πρεσβύτερος Ἰωάννης, τοῦ κυρίου μαθηταὶ, λέγουσιν. οὐ γὰρ τὰ ἐκ τῶν βιβλίων τοσοῦτόν με ὠφελεῖν ὑπελάμβανον ὅσον τὰ παρὰ ζώσης φωνῆς καὶ μενούσης».
(5.) ἔνθα καὶ ἐπιστῆσαι ἄξιον δὶς καταριθμοῦντι αὐτῷ τὸ Ἰωάννου ὄνομα, ὧν τὸν μὲν πρότερον Πέτρῳ καὶ Ἰακώβῳ καὶ Ματθαίῳ καὶ τοῖς λοιποῖς ἀποστόλοις συγκαταλέγει, σαφῶς δηλῶν τὸν εὐαγγελιστήν, τὸν δ’ ἕτερον Ἰωάννην, διαστείλας τὸν λόγον, ἑτέροις παρὰ τὸν τῶν ἀποστόλων ἀριθμὸν κατατάσσει, προτάξας αὐτοῦ τὸν Ἀριστίωνα, σαφῶς τε αὐτὸν πρεσβύτερον ὀνομάζει· (6.) ὡς καὶ διὰ τούτων ἀποδείκνυσθαι τὴν ἱστορίαν ἀληθῆ τῶν δύο κατὰ τὴν Ἀσίαν ὁμωνυμίᾳ κεχρῆσθαι εἰρηκότων δύο τε ἐν Ἐφέσῳ γενέσθαι μνήματα καὶ ἑκάτερον Ἰωάννου ἔτι νῦν λέγεσθαι· οἷς καὶ ἀναγκαῖον προσέχειν τὸν νοῦν, εἰκὸς γὰρ τὸν δεύτερον, εἰ μή τις ἐθέλοι τὸν πρῶτον, τὴν ἐπ’ ὀνόματος φερομένην Ἰωάννου ἀποκάλυψιν ἑορακέναι.
[Quotation from Papias] '(4.) "But, if any one came, who had attended the elders [i.e. the Apostles and their followers], I questioned him about the words of the elders: what did Andrew or what did Peter say, or what does Philip, or Thomas, or James, or John, or Matthew, or any other of the disciples of the Lord, and what does Aristiōn and the elder John, disciples of the Lord, say? For I believed that what was to be drawn from the books would not profit me as much as what came from a living and abiding voice."
[Eusebius’ comment] '(5.) It is worthwhile observing here that he mentions the name John twice. The first of these he enumerates among Peter and James and Matthew and the rest of the Apostles, clearly meaning the Evangelist; but the other John, separating him in the text, he enumerates among others, outside of the number of the apostles, putting Aristion before him, and he clearly calls him "elder" [presbyteros πρεσβύτερος]. (6.) This shows that the claim of those is true, who say that there were two persons in Asia that bore the same name, and that two tombs were made in Ephesus, each of which, even to the present day, is called John's. It is important to notice this, for it is probable that it was the second [John the Elder] who saw the Revelation, which has survived under the name of John, if one is unwilling to admit that it was the first.'
Text: Schwartz et al. 1999. Translation: E. Rizos.
Eusebius quotes a fragment from Papias of Hierapolis (early 2nd c. AD), who reports having collected oral traditions about the doctrines of the Apostles from people who had met them:
(4.) «εἰ δέ που καὶ παρηκολουθηκώς τις τοῖς πρεσβυτέροις ἔλθοι, τοὺς τῶν πρεσβυτέρων ἀνέκρινον λόγους, τί Ἀνδρέας ἢ τί Πέτρος εἶπεν ἢ τί Φίλιππος ἢ τί Θωμᾶς ἢ Ἰάκωβος ἢ τί Ἰωάννης ἢ Ματθαῖος ἤ τις ἕτερος τῶν τοῦ κυρίου μαθητῶν ἅ τε Ἀριστίων καὶ ὁ πρεσβύτερος Ἰωάννης, τοῦ κυρίου μαθηταὶ, λέγουσιν. οὐ γὰρ τὰ ἐκ τῶν βιβλίων τοσοῦτόν με ὠφελεῖν ὑπελάμβανον ὅσον τὰ παρὰ ζώσης φωνῆς καὶ μενούσης».
(5.) ἔνθα καὶ ἐπιστῆσαι ἄξιον δὶς καταριθμοῦντι αὐτῷ τὸ Ἰωάννου ὄνομα, ὧν τὸν μὲν πρότερον Πέτρῳ καὶ Ἰακώβῳ καὶ Ματθαίῳ καὶ τοῖς λοιποῖς ἀποστόλοις συγκαταλέγει, σαφῶς δηλῶν τὸν εὐαγγελιστήν, τὸν δ’ ἕτερον Ἰωάννην, διαστείλας τὸν λόγον, ἑτέροις παρὰ τὸν τῶν ἀποστόλων ἀριθμὸν κατατάσσει, προτάξας αὐτοῦ τὸν Ἀριστίωνα, σαφῶς τε αὐτὸν πρεσβύτερον ὀνομάζει· (6.) ὡς καὶ διὰ τούτων ἀποδείκνυσθαι τὴν ἱστορίαν ἀληθῆ τῶν δύο κατὰ τὴν Ἀσίαν ὁμωνυμίᾳ κεχρῆσθαι εἰρηκότων δύο τε ἐν Ἐφέσῳ γενέσθαι μνήματα καὶ ἑκάτερον Ἰωάννου ἔτι νῦν λέγεσθαι· οἷς καὶ ἀναγκαῖον προσέχειν τὸν νοῦν, εἰκὸς γὰρ τὸν δεύτερον, εἰ μή τις ἐθέλοι τὸν πρῶτον, τὴν ἐπ’ ὀνόματος φερομένην Ἰωάννου ἀποκάλυψιν ἑορακέναι.
[Quotation from Papias] '(4.) "But, if any one came, who had attended the elders [i.e. the Apostles and their followers], I questioned him about the words of the elders: what did Andrew or what did Peter say, or what does Philip, or Thomas, or James, or John, or Matthew, or any other of the disciples of the Lord, and what does Aristiōn and the elder John, disciples of the Lord, say? For I believed that what was to be drawn from the books would not profit me as much as what came from a living and abiding voice."
[Eusebius’ comment] '(5.) It is worthwhile observing here that he mentions the name John twice. The first of these he enumerates among Peter and James and Matthew and the rest of the Apostles, clearly meaning the Evangelist; but the other John, separating him in the text, he enumerates among others, outside of the number of the apostles, putting Aristion before him, and he clearly calls him "elder" [presbyteros πρεσβύτερος]. (6.) This shows that the claim of those is true, who say that there were two persons in Asia that bore the same name, and that two tombs were made in Ephesus, each of which, even to the present day, is called John's. It is important to notice this, for it is probable that it was the second [John the Elder] who saw the Revelation, which has survived under the name of John, if one is unwilling to admit that it was the first.'
Text: Schwartz et al. 1999. Translation: E. Rizos.
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